Rampage (PK) Discussion

    It just feels like a pretty big grey area, because the only solution I can think of that might make most people happy is to split into two servers, a server with pk and a server without it. And you could label them the PvP and non-PvP server. But the differences between them would be marginal. Changing the system to be more lax or more harsh would piss off the other camp quite a bit.

    We already have a world PvP system with factions, and in a dedicated "PvP server" why even have restrictions or debuffs for PK at all? Why send them to prison? The point of the server is to do PvP. Very very few people want unpunished and unrestricted PK (As seen in the poll I made that has almost 100 votes now), but keeping it in with the prison system would feel awkward in a PvP server dedicated to player vs player. It would still be used by only a tiny fraction of the server population.

    Meanwhile what about the PvE server? How would it be substantially different from the PvP one? Yes there would be no PK, but the PK function is likely going to hardly ever be used anyway. What about the other forms of PvP? Will it still have open world PvP via factions? Will it still have arenas? Etc? But why would anyone play them when they could play on the dedicated PvP server where they know PvP is going to flock to?


    As of right now at 93 votes on the poll, 61% of the people think the current PK system is fine and another 14% think it should be less harsh. That is 75% of people that fall into the "Pro-PK" camp. or at least Fine with the current PK system. Would those people be happy to see the community artificially split over such an insignificant system? Lots of people enjoy both PvP and PvE and splitting it into two servers would essentially force people to pick one, or would leave the PvE server pretty dead. Because most people who are fine with both tend to just opt for the PvP server.


    Only about 10% of the people polled so far want to see the system be made even harsher on PKers (but not removed). It definitely seems like people significantly upset with this system are a minority. And trying to label this as a pro-choice argument will only result in fracturing the community over features that most people don't have strong positive or negative opinions about.

    I really don't think they'd go through the cost of running a completely different server that nobody is asking for or requesting. Especially when all they'd have to do is edit some settings to make opt-out of rampage system a thing.


    Dev 1-"Hey other devs, let's tweak a few values in-game to make rampage system optional"


    Dev 2- "No thanks, instead, let's work and maintain an entirely different server that no one is asking for or suggesting, add more staff to our development team, and remove all pvp features from one server instead of your idea"





    I'm sure you already know this, but whatever poll that is, is irrelevant with those amount of numbers. 93 People rounded off to 100, out of a thousand are statistically the chance of winning a lottery. Yet there are eleven thousand players on discord, if you cut those in half, 6 thousand people actually played the beta. Out of 6000 votes (god forbid 11,000) , 100 votes does not even come close to representing the "Majority" Even if it was 90% of people wanting to remove pk from the game, it still would be nowhere near enough votes.


    Not that you claimed that it would. But the poll is as irrelevant as what toppings i would like on a pizza right now are.

    Someone else's opinions or how many likes I can receive will never go into consideration before I press submit to any of my posts.



    Ignorance remains forever ignored.

    But in all that, I still don't see an answer as to why people have to be forced to pvp. And the original suggestion of the thread (title), isn't even an OPTION in the poll. Kind of Ironic, How there is no option to get options x:

    The poll has been posted here on these forums, on reddit, and on the discord. So it has a fairly even mix of people across all the major social media communities so far. You don't need a poll of every single player to get an idea on what the player base wants, and evenly distributed random mix of voters can give you a good enough estimate to extrapolate up even with just a couple hundred. That is how modern polling and statistics has worked for a while. I am not saying these are the final results either. Just sharing the progress.


    PK is inherently by its nature, non-optional. The difference between a PK and a PvP conflict is that PvP is opt in and PK is not. So saying the PK should be optional is just turning it into normal PvP and it then ceases to be PK.

    The reddit poll is completely irrelevant since it does not even have the option that started this thread. How about you make it simple:


    Do you want to have the option to opt out of being a target for Rampage (call it PK, PVP or tilling at windmills who cares) in SOLO?

    1. yes

    2. no


    That is what people are asking, not for separate servers, removal of all PVP in the game etc.

    I just answered that in the above post, if you can opt out of PK then any open world fighting is just PvP because you are assumed opt in. The nature of PK is that you can't opt out. Its not a PK otherwise. So you are just asking for removal of the PK system.

    PvP == Player vs. Player

    PK == player kill


    so it is basically the same, it's just that PvP is usually refered to organized PvP and PK is not.
    Ppl seem to confuse PK with "killing non pvplers exclusivly" or "playing killer in the open world/non pvp maps" x:

    It isn't basically the same, there is no set definition for PvP and PK (Beyond what the acronyms expand into) but it seems like you are most definitely interpreting the meaning of PK to fit your own biases, not how they are most commonly used or intended for.

    Yes, I admit I am not aware how those terms might be used now as compared to a few decades ago.

    So tell me:
    PK = Killing people who don't want anything to do with Pvp, forcing them into a pvp situation?
    PK = Killing people in a backstabbing way while they are busy fighting mosnters or talking to NPCs, forcing them into a pvp situation?

    PK = Killing people by surprise who are worse equipped/built, forcing them into a pvp situation?

    PK = ... , forcing them into a pvp situation?

    ...what ever else? which one is the most used? x:

    But yea, if you say PK is only PK when it is forced upon others, then I guess: Yes. I want it removed and replaced with PvP.

    PK = Killing people who don't want anything to do with Pvp, forcing them into a pvp situation? <- its this one, and its why all the games (that are not explicitly open world PvP all the time) with a PK system also have a prison/jail system. The other ones (while sometimes crappy) are not stuff that would normally land you in in-game jail.

    And can you explaing what is fun about forcing other people to do something they don't want to do?


    (Also, I know jail systems that are used for players that ger reported (for x behaviour etc), so there is also that possibilty for example.)

    I mean in Age of Wushu I was kidnapping logged out players. It was called getting PKed when one would get killed for kidnapping, but it was a choice to partake in that and I was not forced into a situation without choice. but my memory might be blury~ hmh

    Then let me suggest: PvP players to have no choice to.. let's say, work as a slave for a PKed person as punishment for an hour.
    Or they have no choice that everytime they die, they lose a character level while in Rampage mode?

    Or they have no choice... but to do a 1h long jumping puzzle. Or they have no choice but to not get any PvE loot/rewards for 8h?

    Just some suggestions to force - potentially undesired - content on them? x:

    So far, no PKer answered my question above (earlier post) yet #sadme

    <-- just airing my thoughts~

    The PK option in game involves a punishment system that will definitely turn off PKing in the Open World. You reach a negative KI level it could be 40 it could be the full 150 (I think that is the max, again I could be wrong however, whatever the max is I capped instantly.) Now, because I'm a little more of a structured PvPer I wanted to test this "system" and instead of moving to 40 I got all 150 negative Ki and got sent to prison. The negative Ki punishment system is RNG you could get a punishment from the first kill and max out the Ki like I did or you can get 40 or 50 from a kill and the next kill is the one that incarcerates you. In the end you get sent to prison and have to do repeatable quests to get out. One quest makes you carry rocks at an extremely slow hair pulling, teeth gritting, rage inducing speed. Upon completion of this quest it gives you a potion and that potion allows you to remove 4 negative Ki from your total. Now, there is another quest in there that makes you take a tome and listen to mantras and lectures. For each 3 minutes you are there it removes 1 point of negative Ki. You can actually AFK for this if you want but either way you cannot leave the prison until all your negative Ki is gone. Meaning if you get on the next day and still have negative Ki, you are still in the prison in-game. I did a combination of both the Rock Quest and the Tome Quest to get out and at max if I add up everything it was about 7 to 8 hours of my game time. In conclusion, i would only use the rampage function if it was it was me defending one of my friends as the penalty is too steep.

    Quote from Wang Wu

    The PK option in game involves a punishment system that will definitely turn off PKing in the Open World. You reach a negative KI level it could be 40 it could be the full 150 (I think that is the max, again I could be wrong however, whatever the max is I capped instantly.) Now, because I'm a little more of a structured PvPer I wanted to test this "system" and instead of moving to 40 I got all 150 negative Ki and got sent to prison. The negative Ki punishment system is RNG you could get a punishment from the first kill and max out the Ki like I did or you can get 40 or 50 from a kill and the next kill is the one that incarcerates you. In the end you get sent to prison and have to do repeatable quests to get out. One quest makes you carry rocks at an extremely slow hair pulling, teeth gritting, rage inducing speed. Upon completion of this quest it gives you a potion and that potion allows you to remove 4 negative Ki from your total. Now, there is another quest in there that makes you take a tome and listen to mantras and lectures. For each 3 minutes you are there it removes 1 point of negative Ki. You can actually AFK for this if you want but either way you cannot leave the prison until all your negative Ki is gone. Meaning if you get on the next day and still have negative Ki, you are still in the prison in-game. I did a combination of both the Rock Quest and the Tome Quest to get out and at max if I add up everything it was about 7 to 8 hours of my game time. In conclusion, i would only use the rampage function if it was it was me defending one of my friends as the penalty is too steep.

    I agree the penalty for anything other than that is definitely too steep. Overall this was well explained, thanks!

    But according to your "figures", hardly anyone would turn it off? So what's your problem?

    You've hopefully never had nor will have children.

    You carebears have 1000s of pve games, stop trying to ruing the .0001% that actually have an open world.


    Imagine EVE without its open PVP. It wouldn't be EVE. Imagine L2.. no one would think it was the greatest game ever if not for its open pvp, on the contrary, it would have been a trash game made of lead in a sea of pve junk


    PKK can't exist without PK, and imo it should be rewarding like it sometimes was in PW/FW/L2. bound gear that can't drop really ruins it.

    PK is something the game needs. Beside that, the faction pvp is even worse then the normal rampage mode for players. Once you reached Student and turn the faction mode on,, its just war. But thats the game. You need to play a little bit of pvp. Specially for the dailys on the faction map. Thats how it is. But you are not alone. You will have friends or guilds that will help you.

    So in short, you are also unable to answer my question, and instead opt for name calling :3

    I did more or less answer you, but let me quote my angsty friend



    For me personally I like to PKK in games where they can drop gear or lose days of grind or have to buy a blessed res. If I'm bored I'll sometimes pk, but there is always people who show up.


    MMOs are about interaction, it's f***ing boring when it feels like you're a million miles away, I don't understand why everyone wants a carebear fest. Yes getting stunned and dying to mobs or whatever sucks but deal with it, get a friend! Log out, ask for help, something. Everyone wants SOLO "mmos" these days...


    Getting more powerful is incentive to grind, but you don't really get that in PVE games. I don't care about structured pvp. I want open sieges and PK. There hasn't been any games like this in nearly a decade.

    Very well said, and I've also said this before. If you don't like pvp, just go play a pve only game, don't try to go change a game's pvp when you aren't even interested in it.